#1081
[account deactivated]
#1082
that isn't very christmassey tuppins
#1083
you: arguing on the internet
me: shitposting on christmas day
#1084

Panopticon posted:

Gibbonstrength posted:

i recommended Althusser without further comment because it's not my appointed role to tackle panopticon every time he asks for data inputs or whatever he wants.

dont be surprised when you fail to convince anyone of your arguments then



Why is it other people's duty to convince you of anything? You're an adult with a good brain who can do stuff for himself.

#1085
http://civilmarch.org/manifesto/

hahaha oh wow
#1086

marimite posted:

http://civilmarch.org/manifesto/hahaha oh wow



It's the People's Crusade but now it's #woke.

#1087
read hegel
#1088

Gibbonstrength posted:

Panopticon posted:
Gibbonstrength posted:
i recommended Althusser without further comment because it's not my appointed role to tackle panopticon every time he asks for data inputs or whatever he wants.
dont be surprised when you fail to convince anyone of your arguments then


Why is it other people's duty to convince you of anything? You're an adult with a good brain who can do stuff for himself.


it's called a dialectic

#1089

Red_Canadian posted:

international marxist-humanist organisation? imho that's pretty dumb. how can you be marxist, with material conditions being paramount, and humanist.



ask andrew kliman

#1090
and when you're done. tell that to nemtsov
#1091

marimite posted:

http://civilmarch.org/manifesto/hahaha oh wow


In other news, 3,000 people disappeared near the Turkish border city of Edirne

#1092
I did this for Canada for groups over 1,000 dues-paying members that call for the abolition of capitalism :

Supports Syrian Government:
None.

Neutral or YPG Only:
None.

Supports Opposition:
None.
#1093
Urbandale...you have given me a rare downvote...prepare to be brutally owned in my EuroHoxjaist grouplet's biannual newsletter
#1094

getfiscal posted:

I did this for Canada for groups over 1,000 dues-paying members that call for the abolition of capitalism :

Supports Syrian Government:
None.

Neutral or YPG Only:
None.

Supports Opposition:
None.



Don't worry, this will change soon. I've been building class consciousness by hanging out at Tim Horton's and when I overhear people complaining about their job I make eye contact and say "That's crapitalism!"

#1095
panopticon is often a brick wall but i really dislike the argument that its not our job to educate someone. cuz it is, if we're being honest. on the other hand this is a forum, not an organization, so i didnt say anything about it, i just downvoted.
#1096

Panopticon posted:

if you don't have a set of moral values to judge successes and failures against, how can you advocate for any kind of change in the real world?



anyway the correct answer to this question was in fact "very carefully".

#1097
Anyone familiar with how legit the Syrian elections were? I know there were international observers, but the 10.3 million number seems pretty amazing to me.
#1098

marimite posted:



I've been thinking about this a lot too. They made a huge stink during the elections and got a lot of observers in there, I'm sure it was well monitored but I'm sure there's like an acceptable level of fraud involved too. I also have a feeling Assad was actually just popular as hell.

#1099
There appears to be no evidence it was any less trustworthy than any other bourgeois democratic election
#1100
syria is the second most democratic country in the world
#1101
"A cease-fire has technically been in place across Syria since Friday, and violence is lower than usual," NPR's Alice Fordham reports from Beirut. "But the opposition says the regime has pressed offensives in the suburbs of Damascus and a river valley northwest of the capital in violation of the agreement."

hmm i wonder why theyd do that

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-syria-water-idUSKBN14C20Q

The Damascus water authority has been forced to cut supplies coming into the Syrian capital for a few days and use reserves instead after rebels polluted the water with diesel, it said on Friday.

The al-Fija spring which supplies Damascus with water is in the rebel-held Wadi Barada valley northwest of the capital in a mountainous area near the Lebanese border.

#1102

ilmdge posted:

"A cease-fire has technically been in place across Syria since Friday, and violence is lower than usual," NPR's Alice Fordham reports from Beirut. "But the opposition says the regime has pressed offensives in the suburbs of Damascus and a river valley northwest of the capital in violation of the agreement."

hmm i wonder why theyd do that

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-syria-water-idUSKBN14C20Q

The Damascus water authority has been forced to cut supplies coming into the Syrian capital for a few days and use reserves instead after rebels polluted the water with diesel, it said on Friday.

The al-Fija spring which supplies Damascus with water is in the rebel-held Wadi Barada valley northwest of the capital in a mountainous area near the Lebanese border.



It truly is a mystery.

#1103

This seems bad, although I can't read what it says,...or the Arabic either!!!

Edited by ilmdge ()

#1104
we need a new syria masterpost/video/thing to disseminate
#1105
[account deactivated]
#1106
exclusive photo of "mohammed diab" at the signing
#1107


Inquiry Points Toward a Pentagon Plot to Subvert Obama’s Syria Policy(we broke the cease fire and bombed the syrian army on purpose as you might have suspected)

Posted on Jan 5, 2017
By Gareth Porter

Airstrikes by the United States and its allies against two Syrian army positions Sept. 17 killed at least 62 Syrian troops and wounded dozens more. The attack was quickly treated as a non-story by the U.S. news media; U.S. Central Command (CENTCOM) claimed the strikes were carried out in the mistaken belief that Islamic State forces were being targeted, and the story disappeared.

The circumstances surrounding the attack, however, suggested it may have been deliberate, its purpose being to sabotage President Obama’s policy of coordinating with Russia against Islamic State and Nusra Front forces in Syria as part of a U.S.-Russian cease-fire agreement.

Normally the U.S. military can cover up illegal operations and mistakes with a pro forma military investigation that publicly clears those responsible. But the air attack on Syrian troops also involved three foreign allies in the anti-Islamic State campaign named Operation Inherent Resolve: the United Kingdom, Denmark and Australia. So, the Pentagon had to agree to bring a general from one of those allies into the investigation as a co-author of the report. Consequently, the summary of the investigation released by CENTCOM on Nov. 29 reveals far more than the Pentagon and CENTCOM brass would have desired.

Thanks to that heavily redacted report, we now have detailed evidence that the commander of CENTCOM’s Air Force component attacked the Syrian army deliberately.

The Motives Behind a Pentagon Scheme

Secretary of Defense Ashton Carter and the military establishment had a compelling motive in the attack of Sept. 17—namely, interest in maintaining the narrative of a “new Cold War” with Russia, which is crucial to supporting and expanding the budgets of their institutions. When negotiations on a comprehensive cease-fire agreement with Russia, including provisions for U.S.-Russian cooperation on air operations against Islamic State and Nusra Front, appeared to gain traction last spring, the Pentagon began making leaks to the news media about its opposition to the Obama policy. Those receiving the leaks included neoconservative hawk Josh Rogin, who had just become a columnist at The Washington Post.

After Secretary of State John Kerry struck an agreement Sept. 9 that contained a provision to set up a “Joint Integration Center” (JIC) for U.S.-Russian cooperation in targeting, the Pentagon sought to reverse it. Carter grilled Kerry for hours in an effort to force him to retreat from that provision, according to The New York Times.

Lobbying against the JIC continued the following week after Obama approved the full agreement. When the commander of the Central Command’s Air Force component, Lt. Gen. Jeffrey L. Harrigan, was asked about the JIC at a press briefing Sept. 13, he seemed to suggest that opponents of the provision were still hoping to avoid cooperating with the Russians on targeting. He told reporters that his readiness to join such a joint operation was “going to depend on what the plan ends up being.”

But the Pentagon also had another motive for hitting Syrian troops in Deir Ezzor. On June 16, Russian planes attacked a remote outpost of a CIA-supported armed group, called the New Syrian Army, in Deir Ezzor province near the confluence of Iraq, Syria and Jordan. The Pentagon demanded an explanation for the attack but never got it.

For senior leaders of the Pentagon and others in the military, a strike against Syrian army positions in Deir Ezzor would not only offer the prospect of avoiding the threat of cooperating with Russia militarily, it would also be payback for what many believed was a Russian poke in the U.S. eye.

The Evidence in the Investigation Report

On Sept. 16, Gen. Harrigan, who also headed the Combined Air Operations Center (CAOC) at al-Udeid airbase in Qatar, set in motion the planning for the attack on the two Syrian army positions. The process began, according to the investigation report, on Sept. 16, when Harrigan’s command identified two fighting positions near the Deir Ezzor airport as belonging to Islamic State, based on drone images showing that the personnel there were not wearing uniform military garb and, supposedly, displayed no flags.

But, as a former intelligence analyst told me, that was not a legitimate basis for a positive identification of the sites as Islamic State-controlled because Syrian army troops in the field frequently wear a wide range of uniforms and civilian clothing.

The report contains the incriminating revelation that the authorities at CAOC had plenty of intelligence warning that its identification was flat wrong. Before the strike, the regional station of the Distributed Common Ground System, which is the Air Force’s primary intelligence organ for interpreting data from aerial surveillance, contested the original identification of the units, sending its own assessment that they could not possibly be Islamic State. Another pre-strike intelligence report, moreover, pointed to what appeared to be a flag at one of the two sites. And a map of the area that was available to intelligence analysts at CAOC clearly showed that the sites were occupied by the Syrian army. Harrigan and his command apparently claimed, implausibly, that they were unaware of any of this information.

Further evidence that Harrigan meant to strike Syrian army targets was the haste with which the strike was carried out, the day after the initial intelligence assessment was made. The investigation summary acknowledges that the decision to go ahead with a strike so soon after the target had been initially assessed was a violation of Air Force regulations.

It had started out as a “deliberate target development” process—one that did not require an immediate decision and could therefore allow for a more careful analysis of intelligence. That was because the targets were clearly fixed ground positions, so there was no need for an immediate strike. Nevertheless, the decision was made to change it to a “dynamic targeting process,” normally reserved for situations in which the target is moving, to justify an immediate strike on Sept. 17.

No one in Harrigan’s command, including the commander himself, would acknowledge having made that decision. That would have been a tacit admission that the attack was far more than an innocent mistake.

The Deir Ezzor strike appears to have been timed to provoke a breakdown of the cease-fire before the JIC could be formed, which was originally to be after seven days of effective truce—meaning Sept. 19. Obama added a requirement for the completion of humanitarian shipments from the Turkish border, but the opponents of the JIC could not count on the Syrian government continuing to hold up the truck convoys. That meant that Harrigan would need to move urgently to carry out the strike.

Perhaps the single most damaging piece of evidence that the strike was knowingly targeting Syrian army bases is the fact that Harrigan’s command sent the Russians very specific misleading information on the targets of the operation. It informed its Russian contact under the deconfliction agreement that the two targets were nine kilometers south of Deir Ezzor airfield, but in fact they were only three and six kilometers away, respectively, according to the summary. Accurate information about the locations would have set off alarm bells among the Russians, because they would have known immediately that Syrian army bases were being targeted, as the U.S. co-author of the investigation report, Gen. Richard Coe, acknowledged to reporters.

‘Who is in charge in Washington?’

Gen. Harrigan’s strike worked like a charm in terms of the interests of those behind it. The hope of provoking a Syrian-Russian decision to end the cease-fire and thus the plan for the JIC was apparently based on the assumption that it would be perceived by both Russians and Syrians as evidence that Obama was not in control of U.S. policy and therefore could not be trusted as a partner in managing the conflict. That assumption proved correct. When Russia’s ambassador to the United Nations, Vitaly Churkin, spoke to reporters at a press briefing outside a U.N. Security Council emergency meeting on the U.S. attack on Syrian troops, he asked rhetorically, “Who is in charge in Washington? The White House or the Pentagon?”

Seemingly no longer convinced that Obama was in control of his own military in Syria, Russian President Vladimir Putin pulled the plug on his U.S. strategy. Two days after the attacks, Syria announced, with obvious Russian support, that the cease-fire was no longer in effect.

The political-diplomatic consequences for Syrians and for the United States, however, were severe. The Russian and Syrian air forces began a campaign of heavy airstrikes in Aleppo that became the single focus of media attention on Syria. In mid-December, Secretary of State Kerry recalled in an interview with The Boston Globe that he had had an agreement with the Russians that would have given the United States “a veto over their flights. …” He lamented that “you’d have a different situation there now if we’d been able to do that.”

But it didn’t happen, Kerry noted, because “we had people in our government who were bitterly opposed to doing that.” What he didn’t say was that those people had the power and the audacity to frustrate the will of the president of the United States.


http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/report_points_to_a_pentagon_plot_to_subvert_obamas_syria_policy_20170105

#1108
General Harrigan, YOU SIR, have committed TREASON!
#1109
i don't have any access to privileged knowledge about what's going on but even bernie bros, really anyone with their head up, realizes we're seeing a rare public crest of U.S. deep state internal conflict that's usually a lot better hidden and purposely muddled. i was vocally skeptical about this description of the calls the FBI made concerning clinton in the days before the election, but i guess that's what i get for thinking normie in the Matrix.
#1110
now the intelligence agencies are literally trying to revenge-psyop the president elect using buzzfeed? this post isn't on topic? mods??
#1111
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jan/10/obama-hoped-to-use-isis-as-leverage-against-assad-/

Conservatives accidentally reporting truth again??? Unfortunately since the election any news that isn't wapo or buzzfeed might as well be breitbart for liberals, not gonna get much traction out of this one.
#1112
im watching some of the old assad interviews and it's hilarious how hard they push their talking points

paraphrasing below:

-----

interviewer: the syrian army has been bombing civilians in aleppo, do you condone this? *holds up picture of wounded child*

assad: every war has casualties, this is the nature of violent conflict. the syrian military does not target civilians intentionally. furthermore, that photo has been pushed and manipulated by western propaganda on multiple stories.

interviewer: how do you sleep at night?

-----

interviewer: do you use barrel bombs?

assad: we use the types of conventional weapons you'd find in any military. these weapons have names and numbers unlike this "barrel bomb" that means nothing and does not exist

interviewer: so you don't deny using barrel bombs?

-----

interviewer: russia is helping you. what did they ask for in return?

assad: nothing

interviewer: yes, but what do you owe them?

assad: russia respects our sovereignty and the need to fight terrorists. the west only understands alliances in terms of business.

interviewer: ok, but what kind of favor do they expect from you?

-----

interviewer: john kerry and other western leaders want you to step down from power, how do you respond?

assad: their opinion does not matter to me, the only thing that matters is the will of the syrian people

interviewer: would you be willing to share power with the moderate rebels?

assad: there are no moderate rebels *lists a bunch of right-wing terrorist groups*

interviewer: so you won't step down?

assad: i answer only to the syrian people, they elected me and if it is their wish that i leave, then i will leave

interviewer: you don't compromise do you?

-----

this guy is the worst -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ItP5bLZ8H8
#1113
reminds me of when vasily gatov punked Vox last month by refusing to be a good little putin hater



there is such a foolproof filter on the Russian/EE "security experts" that usually get doled out for interviews that i almost feel sorry for the interviewer.

Gatov is in no way a Putin supporter but he is an expert in media communications and used to dealing with the superior "gotcha" art of russian journalists, so he keeps doing tai chi moves on the questions, saying like, "oh, that's no doubt true but you have to realize, actually it's not true at all lol" and the Vox guy just starts frothing at him.

the interviewer by the way is Sean Illing, a "political science" professor Troop who spent 3 years in USAF before getting a Ph.D. in beige and starting A Blog. never had a chance
#1114
I enjoy people getting dunked on but I shan't be paying attention to this 'news' stuff people keep referring to
#1115
#1116
#1117
obligatory "you yada-yada'd the best part!" / "no, I mentioned overthrowing Assad"
#1118

Urbandale posted:

we need a new syria masterpost/video/thing to disseminate


this is fairly good http://fair.org/home/in-syria-western-media-cheer-al-qaeda/

#1119
this story is 2+ years old but a swampman retweet just brought it to my attention
https://www.thenation.com/article/saudi-lobbying-complex-adds-new-member-gop-super-pac-chair-norm-coleman/

#1120
haha, whoops!

it's a little mind-blowing even for me that hasn't gotten more traction given how low-level saudi-hating is still permissible among u.s. journalists/opinionators