Makeshift_Swahili posted:the unwillingness to listen to mccoy seems bizarre now....
it's one thing to state that there's a problem and a nebulous indistinct complicity by unnamed parts of the establishment, it's another to name names and reveal the structure and planned, deliberate nature of the "problem" so that it could actually be solved.
bourgeois politics is all about paying lip service to remedying something while knowing on some level that it is a part of the way the machine functions and should never truly be addressed. using factual information to force the political class into cognitive dissonance about this is a major faux pas!
gyrofry posted:speaking of the pike committee i've spent the last decade trying to find audio/video of it somewhere. if anybody knows of any, holla
it's likely it doesn't exist anywhere anymore, even in the hands of the u.s. government. the material we have was leaked and that was a while ago.
shriekingviolet posted:Makeshift_Swahili posted:the unwillingness to listen to mccoy seems bizarre now....
it's one thing to state that there's a problem and a nebulous indistinct complicity by unnamed parts of the establishment, it's another to name names and reveal the structure and planned, deliberate nature of the "problem" so that it could actually be solved.
bourgeois politics is all about paying lip service to remedying something while knowing on some level that it is a part of the way the machine functions and should never truly be addressed. using factual information to force the political class into cognitive dissonance about this is a major faux pas!
i agree with you, but when i post these newspaper articles i think you'll be surprised how much of the details (including naming names) are there. im still going through these archives and i'll post the best shit soon. obviously it can't compete with a 400 page book, but its not like these details werent out there in one of the biggest papers in the nation. maybe i should try to check NYT or wall street journal or w/e to see if they printed stories also.
from jack anderson's may 10 1971 column
Interesting that here we have a CIA-agent-cum-Republican-senator making allegations against South Vietnamese and Laos officials. Like this was just a matter of oriental bastards preying on are boys
how do u embed particular times? im not gonna watch the whole thing but the "our politicians wont let us win" myth is in full swing here...
Edited by Chthonic_Goat_666 ()
Chthonic_Goat_666 posted:http://youtu.be/BQpPxXKG_lE?t=1h9m47show do u embed particular times? im not gonna watch the whole thing but the "our politicians wont let us win" myth is in full swing here...
BQpPxXKG_lE&start;=4187
edit: idk why but for me even tho the embed code looks okay it keeps starting at 1h9m29s. ymmv
Petrol posted:The Times (London) 9 July 1971, p6:
Interesting that here we have a CIA-agent-cum-Republican-senator making allegations against South Vietnamese and Laos officials. Like this was just a matter of oriental bastards preying on are boys
it'd be interesting to get this steele guys report/testimonial or w/e. jack anderson's already printed the cia connection by may 5 1971, although the claim is that they're now cracking down on it. appears he's getting it from steele but its hard to be sure without going to the source i guess:
looks more like an omission on the london times' behalf. interested to read the proper mccoy stuff to see how well things line up.
Edited by Chthonic_Goat_666 ()
Makeshift_Swahili posted:apparently on June 2 1972 there was a senate committee hearing where alfred mccoy talked about the cia & opium. anyone know where i could get a transcript (or recording) of this online? or is that the kinda stuff they bury deep in some library archive in washington dc?
i spent like 20 minutes digging thru this site to find this, enjoy:
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015019201766;view=1up;seq=709
hathi trust needs better search algorithm or something.
EDIT: better URLs too:
http://tinyurl.com/h37cawc
added to imgur:
http://imgur.com/a/S9egw/
Edited by HenryKrinkle ()
HenryKrinkle posted:Makeshift_Swahili posted:apparently on June 2 1972 there was a senate committee hearing where alfred mccoy talked about the cia & opium. anyone know where i could get a transcript (or recording) of this online? or is that the kinda stuff they bury deep in some library archive in washington dc?
i spent like 20 minutes digging thru this site to find this, enjoy:
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015019201766;view=1up;seq=709hathi trust needs better search algorithm or something.
EDIT: better URLs too:
http://tinyurl.com/h37cawc
added to imgur:
http://imgur.com/a/S9egw/
Lmao. Nice find krikle. Reading what Senator McGee has to say from page 710 onward... how he starts in with "Oh, I appreciate that you're struggling to get your PhD right now so it makes sense you would accuse the CIA of not being entirely ethical at every moment because uh... um, sorry, this isn't for your dissertation?"
HenryKrinkle posted:added to imgur:
http://imgur.com/a/S9egw/
thanks krinkle. that Trần Văn Khiêm guy who writes in the last letter is an interesting character (look him up on wiki)
Edited by Chthonic_Goat_666 ()
Makeshift_Swahili posted:HenryKrinkle posted:added to imgur:
http://imgur.com/a/S9egw/thanks krinkle. that Trần Văn Khiêm guy who writes in the last letter is an interesting character (look him up on wiki)
from letters to the editor in the washington post 6th of April 1972. i was reading up on his murder trial 14 years later and he believed in a conspiracy theory that involved his parents, the death of ngo dinh diem and jfk. weird. seems like a self-serving guy (mostly the "why don't you come back to lead us" line)
but what's real interesting is that its accompanied by a cartoon that is very similar to the famous nazi "stabbed in the back" cartoon.
13th november 1969:
28th october 1970:
20th march 1971
21st march 1971:
11th may 1971:
18th may 1971
23rd may 1971:
13th july 1971:
...article continued....
12 july 1971:
15 july 1971:
28 july 1971:
9 september 1971:
2 june 1972:
2 july 1972:
Makeshift_Swahili posted:
Fuck
c_man posted:the right wing variation of "bumbling CIA" being "bumbling colonial proxies"?
people were looking for reasons to minimse the failures of the us military. drugs (pushed onto our troops by nefarious asians) served as a handy excuse. thomas j dodd was speculating if marijuana was to blame for my lai, for example.
from Washington Post 25th march 1970.
Makeshift_Swahili posted:people were looking for reasons to minimse the failures of the us military. drugs (pushed onto our troops by nefarious asians) served as a handy excuse. thomas j dodd was speculating if marijuana was to blame for my lai, for example.
from Washington Post 25th march 1970.
wow. its a good thing all those hippie college students back home didnt have guns or kent state could have turned out a lot differently
Chthonic_Goat_666 posted:was searching for one of mccoy's old articles but found this instead. recent article on the afghan opium trade and its relation to the war.
pWa0dZMHYeE
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/04/27/asia/kabul-drug-rehab-npw/ posted:Kabul, Afghanistan (CNN) The sound of a bare razor, scraping hair off an unwashed scalp. The shuddering foot of someone struggling with the agony of withdrawal. The endless racks of expensive internet cables that once connected the building to satellites in space but now gather dust.
Months ago, this was Camp Phoenix.
A large and tidy NATO military base, it was home to hundreds of British soldiers and their support staff, and some Americans too.
CNN used to visit for often highly organized media events that NATO laid on in a bid to show the war in Afghanistan was being won, and they could go home. But now victories here are a little more palpable, and something that everyone inside the base's walls can only win over themselves.
Camp Phoenix has been turned into a large and heavily fortified drug rehabilitation center. Walls that once kept the Taliban's bombs out, now keep those struggling with heroin addiction in.
McCoy talks about his experiences researching and writing the original edition of the book in the early 1970. Some good anecdotes:
Over a dinner of pig fat and sticky rice, Ger Su Yang asked Everingham, through our interpreter, what we were doing in his village. Knowing the Hmong leader from previous visits, Everyingham was frank and told him that I was writing a book on opium. For a man who did not read a daily newspaper, Ger Su Yang proposed a bargain that showed a keen sense of media management. He would provide armed men to escort us anywhere in his district and would allow us to ask anything we wanted about the opium. If he did that, could I get an article in a Washington newspaper reporting that the CIA had broken its promise? For ten years, he explained, the men of his village had died fighting in the CIA's army until only the fourteen-year-old boys were left. When he refused to send these boys to die, the CIA had stopped the rice airdrops that fed his village of women and children. After six months the children were visibly weak from hunger. Once the Americans in Washington knew about his situation, surely, said Ger Su Yang, they would send the rice. I promised.
(page xii)
McCoy speaks about his interview technique, which was to ask questions about the historical opium trade (colonial opium monopolies had been operating legally until fairly recently in many countries in the region) before moving closer to current times in an attempt to get them to slip up.
For an hour, he chatted about his family and the career path he had followed in his rise to command. General, I said, that was fine but what about the allegations by your enemies that you stole money when managing the opium syndicate just a few years ago. "Merde! That bastard Phoumi is gossiping again. I am going to stop these rumors for good," muttered General Ouane, referring to his old rival General Phoumi Nosavan, then exiled in Bangkok. Suddenly, that elephantine figure leapt up the stairs with a catlike grace and returned a few minutes later with a heavy, leather-bound ledger. On the cover was the title "Opium Régie Du Laos" (Laotian Opium Monopoly). The general took me through every page, showing what he had paid the tribes for opium in the 1960s, how many kilograms he exported to Vietnam, and the profits he had deposited in the syndicate's bank accounts. I was impressed, particularly since all the transactions took place after 1961 when Laos had abolished its official opium monopoly and made drug dealing illegal. With the general's encouragement, I copied down sample transactions, which appear in the footnotes of this book
(pages xiv-xv)
On page xvii McCoy mentions that Seymour Hersh wrote an article about CIA reaction to McCoy's book... let's read.
(apearing in the New York Times July 22 1972)
Edited by Chthonic_Goat_666 ()
Edited by Chthonic_Goat_666 ()
Petrol posted:Chthonic_Goat_666 posted:http://youtu.be/BQpPxXKG_lE?t=1h9m47show do u embed particular times? im not gonna watch the whole thing but the "our politicians wont let us win" myth is in full swing here...
BQpPxXKG_lE&start;=4187
edit: idk why but for me even tho the embed code looks okay it keeps starting at 1h9m29s. ymmv
this particular link to "No Substitute For Victory" is down for copyright infringement but the whole thing is still on youtube elsewhere, hosted by the Troma youtube account (lol). i guess they own the rights now if you ever wanna see bircher propaganda.
http://michaelharrison.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/Dien-Bien-Phu-Vo-Nguyen-Giap.pdf
there's also a couple congratulatory letters from Ho at the start.
Edited by Chthonic_Goat_666 ()