spectralmarx posted:

Lol dude Soni Sori was raped and tortured by the state and police. As recent as the black ink attack. Again not sure what you're high on. That also doesn't negate her activism for AAP and not the Left parties per se. I've met her personally and only ever have respect for her. N Sundar has written plenty on the choices that residents of Bastar, Sukma etc are caught between. Again read carefully first. Also Bela Bhatia and Jean Dreze being harassed and the scroll reporter. Except just saying adivasis support the maoists would be inadequate and inaccurate.

Your invocation of Soni Sori's recent victimisation in 2016 was immediately following you accusing maoists of subjecting women who depart from the Maoist cause with violence, sexual or otherwise. so i did misunderstand you but it should be easy to see how these appeared conflated

i do not assert that all adivasis support maoism. i am alleging that green hunt contras subject adivasis to indiscriminate violence whether they are affiliated with maoist militancy or not, and that the sectors of adivasi tribal leadership which align with fascist contras are not doing so because of their sincere concern for the wellbeing of the villagers they persecute. my argument here is hinging on the fact that i do not in fact see adivasis as homogenous, they are capable of succumbing to reaction as anyone else

babyhueypnewton posted:

babyhueypnewton posted:

multiple women who wanted to leave were raped and killed.

look up comrade soni sori, a bastar (tribal area) resident and teacher who was raped in prison

This is what your said. Can't read more carefully than to understand that these two sentences follow each other to imply that not only are women who attempt to leave the maoists raped and killed (what a progressive idea you've presented! Everyone who doesn't agree is a fascist!) but that soni sori is an example of this. You've backtracked on that because it's not true but your original post says nothing about the state and police being responsible and heavily implies the opposite.

babyhueypnewton posted:

spectralmarx posted:

Please point to sources instead of rehearsing the obvious anti state position. At some point you will have to find a non state source right? Otherwise your confidence is coming out of your ass. The statement that vills were caught in crossfire and used as guards isn't mine. It's reported using statements from villagers (like I said possibly coerced but maybe not)

http://bannedthought.net/India/index.htm

This was already posted. This is all old anti-communist propaganda, in fact everything you've posted about "being there" and the plethora of real sources has been said by Elliot Higgins about Syria. Doesn't even bother me anymore, just another petty-bourgeois liberal who thinks they put in enough radical time to be anti-communist in the right way.

blinkandwheeze posted:

spectralmarx posted:

Lol dude Soni Sori was raped and tortured by the state and police. As recent as the black ink attack. Again not sure what you're high on. That also doesn't negate her activism for AAP and not the Left parties per se. I've met her personally and only ever have respect for her. N Sundar has written plenty on the choices that residents of Bastar, Sukma etc are caught between. Again read carefully first. Also Bela Bhatia and Jean Dreze being harassed and the scroll reporter. Except just saying adivasis support the maoists would be inadequate and inaccurate.

Your invocation of Soni Sori's recent victimisation in 2016 was immediately following you accusing maoists of subjecting women who depart from the Maoist cause with violence, sexual or otherwise. so i did misunderstand you but it should be easy to see how these appeared conflated

i do not assert that all adivasis support maoism. i am alleging that green hunt contras subject adivasis to indiscriminate violence whether they are affiliated with maoist militancy or not, and that the sectors of adivasi tribal leadership which align with fascist contras are not doing so because of their sincere concern for the wellbeing of the villagers they persecute. my argument here is hinging on the fact that i do not in fact see adivasis as homogenous, they are capable of succumbing to reaction as anyone else

spectralmarx posted:

Not my problem if you want to keep reading them as coherent because hey I'm barely coherent

i was only reading them as coherent until you clarified your point. I have admitted that i misunderstood you, i am not doing so wilfully

spectralmarx posted:

Have you read N Sundar's documentation of Maoist violence and balagopal's works? There's no onus on me. Merely reiterating since you missed this detail earlier

You're the one who asked for counterevidence specifically dealing with the case of the attack in Sukma. your argument here is that historical accounts of maoist violence sympathetic to your perspective are allowable in substantiating an interpretation of the Sukma attack, but not historical accounts which aren't. History is apparently "a tape on loop" when you want it to be

spectralmarx posted:

And don't get me started on CPI m goons across India because you might have romantic notions of it since yore.

BnW may be interested in exposing you further, I am satisfied exposing your anti-communism. Don't expect to convince you but I would never belong to a community where calling one of the most heroic and effective communist parties in the world "goons" wasn't grounds for immediate disavowal. Maybe you can get a job with an NGO in India, they love imperialists who know the language of socialism and can sometimes even delude themselves into believing they are socialists. I'll stick to solidarity with the oppressed and principled anti-fascism and anti-imperialism.

spectralmarx posted:

This is not a safe space anymore

you picked a fight with the two most obnoxious posters to pick a fight with, this was never going to be pretty. i hope you stick around anyway

blinkandwheeze posted:

nobody here would continue to be amenable to someone uncritically repeating IDF claims of the use of human shields in palestine. The only reason that obnoxious maoist force is the one side of this argument here is that you guys don't pay as much attention to India really.

Glad we're on the same page, there's always some liberal with dreams of rising above the other applicants to find the obscure cases that interest imperialism but the propaganda is always the same. I see it a lot wrt Eritrea recently though Venezuela seems to still be the number one for "look I'm a socialist just like you but it really is a dictatorship I even have family there who say so." Not really interested in engaging.

Petrol posted:

well you're right that i, for one, don't know much about the indian situation, but that's just as true after all the above posts, so

I mean i don't think you need to have much significant prior knowledge to realise that claims that the cpi(maoist) use human shields and rape or murder women who try to leave probably need something approaching substantiation

pogfan1996 posted:

There is nothing more boring than an internet squabble with each side demanding the other side produce more sources for their argument

got any sources to back this up?